Closed outs

teknikisler

New Member
Can't a frame be created as in picture 1 regarding the rules regarding the requirement of beams and the creation of a frame system under closed overhangs in buildings? Is it supposed to be like this? It is clear that when it is done in this way, a hanging beam will form in the room, and it will create a negative image in terms of architecture and aesthetics. We won't compromise on static stability from an aesthetic point of view, but is it a requirement?
 
TDY has no compulsion on this issue, but in the zoning regulations or building inspections, it may require a closed frame, although it varies from city to city. It is sufficient to throw the beam 3 times the floor height. If the aim is aesthetic, you can increase the floor height and close it with a suspended ceiling, which is what I do where I do it, it looks very stylish.
 
Due to the earthquake forces, forming a frame by connecting the columns with beams is the most robust solution.
 
"teknikisler":35s291qf" said:
Can't a frame be created as in picture 1 regarding the rules regarding the requirement of beams and the creation of a frame system under closed overhangs in buildings? It is obvious that it will create a negative image in terms of aesthetics. We will not compromise on static stability in terms of aesthetics, but is this a necessity?
The system you added in the 1st picture can be solved by assuming a semi-rigid diaphragm. The slab reinforcement axes are also examined and the moments formed on the slab in a 3d frame are examined. can be adjusted accordingly.
 
"siromar":27ptq781" said:
tdy has no compulsion in this regard, but in zoning regulations or building inspections, although it varies from city to city, it may request a closed frame, in my personal opinion, especially in the 3rd and 4th earthquake zones, which are mandatory in the 1st and 2nd degree earthquake zones. If the goal is aesthetic, you can increase the floor height and cover it with a suspended ceiling, which is what I do, it looks very stylish
the floor height is not unlimited so that it can be increased. zoning regulation It also restricts the total height of the structure. I wish it was that easy. I want those beams too, but it doesn't work.
 
"mhanifiata":2g6dzwdj" said:
floor height is not unlimited so that it should be increased. zoning regulation also restricts the total height of the building. I wish it was that easy. I want those beams too, but it doesn't work.
of course if 6 floors hmax 18m If there is a phrase such as 3m, it must be made 3m, but the hanging beam is 24cm and the suspended ceiling can be a solution even though it increases the cost in the application anyway. The situation is not very different in the hollow floor anyway, the floor height drops to 260 with a 3m screed, clean height, I prefer a suspended ceiling instead of 12cm as everyone agrees. Of course, a 3-axis coiled section is required to connect the columns to each other, as I wrote before, I believe that a necessity should be brought together with the earthquake zone and coefficient to throw the frame beams, which is very important for aesthetics. further ahead...
 
Columns must be connected. Although standards and regulations are flexible in this regard, binding is a necessity. This is how I think and do as a designer. If I were a builder, I would want the columns to be connected in the incoming project. The building inspection implementation regulation gave this initiative to the project inspector of the building inspection company.
 
I'm trying to follow this thread. I also agree with the sensitivities of all my fellow engineers. Like Cenksonmez and my other friends, I would like the framework to be completed and connected, but the reality is not like that. First, connecting the imaginary with beams is nothing but a dream. What good does it do but deceive the engineer himself? In a place where the floor thickness is 10 cm, what would be the minimum height of the beam that you will make as per the regulation? Completion of frameworks is not a regulation. It only consists of an item in the building control form. Would it be good if it was, of course it will. But for this reason, I would like to mention a problem I encountered and emphasize what it caused. Classic beam system is no longer available in our region. Buildings with 5-6-7 floors have been solved with ribbed floors and thus horizontal beams. What have we gained now? Have our structures become safer? Flat beam system in 1st Degree Earthquake zone. Frankly, I don't really appreciate it. Moreover, this system has many other drawbacks. your low floors are a problem in itself, your additional loadings are a problem in itself, your beams that are not perpendicular to each other and that pass through the building are a problem in itself, your chimneys are a problem in itself, the columns that you cannot make long and that you have to expand are also an architectural problem. So are the classic beams you made at the edge points. so after all we supposedly combined the frames...... !? appreciation is our friends. At this rate, I guess I will fight with one of the building inspections who do not give a visa to my project because of the framework that I did not connect. (as they consider themselves superior to the regulations) Sincerely....
 
I completely agree with the points that Mr. NYILMAZ pointed out. He mentioned a very important static problem of our country that is bleeding. I am totally against ribbed flooring after 3 coats. With the amendment to be made in the building inspection law, it is aimed to institutionalize the author companies. Many of the problems we experience as individuals will not be experienced in a company with a serious and institutional foundation, where engineering disciplines, which TMMOB has not been able to do for years, are gathered under a single roof. Of course, we will come across rambling applications of companies in the field. However, when we look at it with the logic of total quality management, the rates of these poor quality projects will decrease. Our problems will be alleviated as the power of the labor gathered under the same roof will stand strong at many points and will not be separated from scientific facts as much as possible with this power from the reflex of standing side by side. But since we cannot change the country, some of our problems will continue. God help us.
 
"cenksonmez":1p43as0j" said:
I completely agree with the points pointed out by Mr. NYILMAZ. He touched on a very important static problem of our country that is bleeding. I am completely against ribbed flooring after 3 floors. With the amendment to the building inspection law, it is aimed to institutionalize the author companies. "Many of the problems we experience individually will not be experienced in a company with a serious and institutional foundation, where engineering disciplines, which TMMOB has not been able to do for years, are gathered under a single roof. Of course, we will come across the raunchy practices of companies in the field. However, when we look at the logic of total quality management, these poor quality project rates will decrease. Our problems will be alleviated as the power of the labor gathered under the same roof will stand strong at many points and will not be separated from scientific facts as much as possible with this power from the reflex of standing side by side. help us.
Hello; Your thoughts are very nice, but I felt the need to make a statement; The construction inspection law, which is trying to be revised (Technical Consultancy Law with its original name) In fact, rather than the establishment of professional project firms, the existing construction inspection firms say, "The situation of the majority of the existing construction inspection firms is deplorable. Rather than doing the building inspection, which is their main duty, they give samples of poor quality projects just to get a job, contrary to the law. He can't even pay the salaries of his employees, and if he goes to construction, he stops by." We are trying to give you the authority to do all kinds of project works that you can think of. It is not possible for us as engineers to accept such a law, which will victimize tens of thousands of project developers and make most of them the prisoner of construction control companies, while these companies do not even fulfill their main tasks while their logic is clear. As IMO BURSA Branch, we have conveyed our reservations and suggestions regarding this law, along with our proposal for the establishment of Professional Project Offices, to the Minister of Environment and Urbanization and the Deputy Prime Minister. From now on, our duty is to protect our profession. Besides, we can't gain anything by criticizing TMMOB from where we sit, we should be involved in the events, we should be involved in the elections and management of the chambers affiliated to TMMOB. We should not shy away from duty and responsibility. If no one is doing something, we should be doing it. I hope that useful laws will be prepared for our profession and colleagues. Best regards.
 
"2m project":j6s22g9q" said:
.......... As IMO BURSA Branch, we present our reservations and suggestions regarding this law, along with the proposal for the establishment of Professional Project Offices, and we continue our Draft Law studies to the Minister of Environment and Urbanization and the Deputy Prime Minister. From now on, our duty is to protect our profession. Besides, we can't gain anything by criticizing TMMOB from where we sit, we should be involved in the events, we should be involved in the elections and management of the chambers affiliated to TMMOB. We should not avoid duty and responsibility. If no one is doing something, we should do it. I hope our profession and colleagues Beneficial laws are prepared for us. Regards.
If I have any consolation, the building inspections do not work badly in the region I am in. The inspections are good, they do not get into the project business. Their work is not bad. Are there any problems? Of course, but in general, they give what is expected. Also, I have time. complaints, problems encountered and solutions, albeit individually. I am writing articles to the ministry of urban planning about the proposals. Sometimes I get answers, even if they are nonsense. I'm throwing something into the sea, now the fish knows or not.
 
Dear 2m project, I made more self-criticism than criticism. I have been a part of TMMOB organization since 2004. I served as Ortaca Representative until 2012. Now I am the deputy representative. While the laws are changing, there are professional disciplines they listen to. In the law on pharmacists, they enacted a law considering even the students studying at the faculty of pharmacy, but our engineering offices, whose students have been working for years, are in danger of closing while enacting the law about us. Our meetings have been going on for the last 1 month due to the necessity of our merger. We are planning to establish a company under a single roof by combining about 20 civil engineers working in the region.
 
In my area; We are the only office that is a project office but not a building inspection company. All building inspections agree with the project as a package. Although they are officially separate, they inspect their own drawings. From the contractor's point of view, it is both cheaper and faster. I would say they don't even look at all. The incident is that serious. In addition, most of the 15-16 storey buildings we build are made of hollow floor, especially after the building inspection comes, all projects are made of hollow floor regardless of the number of floors.
 
What a contradiction indeed. We say to avoid hollow block in earthquake zones, but for architectural and aesthetic solutions, we are forced to make hollow blocks. The ductility level of hollow blocks is already a matter of discussion; In the 1st and 2nd degree earthquake zones, we have to solve the project with hollow block whose ductility is discussed. It can be said that we will give up security for aesthetics. No, of course, but.... (there's a reason)
 
In my project, there is a 50 cm protrusion, I cross it with the floor line, but the municipality says to throw beams, if I throw 25 cm slabs, I do not accept it. Do you have any suggestions?
 
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